[ADVICE] Can they make us pay this???

[Erin_25]

We started renting for the first time in years in March & were advised by the agent that it's all different now & we are to pay all water usage not just excess as we did once upon a time several years ago. We got our first bill just a week ago & it's much like yours from the agent not the water company. However it does state what for, how much, tax invoice no. usual pymt days etc so it is still a bill. We obvioulsy have no probs paying as we were made aware.

I'm thinking someone has told the owners about recent changes & they want to go ahead with you guys paying water usage but obviously it's been dealt with the wrong way - there should have been an agreement or written notice to notify you of any changes.

[Just Me]

Call the RTA if you need advice about your own situation.

This might help a bit in the meantime ... http://www.rta.qld.gov.au/zone_files...eets/water.pdf

Don't agree to anything until you have spoken to the RTA.

[Just Me]

Do you know if your property meets the water efficiency standards? If there aren't water saving devices used on the taps in your house then they can't make you pay.

This is also from the RTA:

Do nothing so the agreement becomes periodic

If you do not extend or sign a new a fixed term agreement, a periodic agreement automatically comes into place. The periodic agreement continues under the same terms that applied to the fixed term agreement except for the end date.

At any time, the tenant and lessor/agent can agree to end the periodic agreement and begin a new fixed term agreement. For more information, see the general tenancy agreements or moveable dwelling tenancy agreements fact sheet.

Under a periodic agreement, rent may be increased by the lessor/agent giving the tenant two months notice in writing of the increase. However, rent can not be increased unless there has been at least six months since the current amount of rent became payable by the tenant.

Changes to the terms of agreements

Tenants are able to negotiate the terms of the proposed new agreement before they sign it. Tenants can dispute significant changes between agreements for the same property with the lessor/ agent, such as excessive rent increases or whether pets are allowed, after they have signed the new agreement. If dispute resolution is unsuccessful, an application to the Tribunal can be made within 30 days after signing the new agreement, to have the significant change reviewed.

This basically means that since you haven't signed the new lease, you are on a periodic lease (basically it means that you can leave at any time with two weeks notice or they can ask you to leave at any time but have to give you 60 days notice). The terms and conditions are still the same though as it would be on your fixed term agreement so if the fixed term agreement was to include you paying for water, it would be applicable from the start date of that fixed term agreement that you didn't sign. I don't think they can make you back pay it.

The other thing with being on a periodic agreement is that they can increase your rent at any time with two months notice. They are only allowed one rent increase every six months. If you were on a fixed term agreement, they would still have to give you two months notice, but would need to wait until the end of the lease period to enforce it. I would imagine that there are also notice periods for changes to the contract, like you having to pay water, but you are probably best to check with the RTA to find out how much notice they have to give you.

I would say that if the new contract started in May, unless there is a metre reading taken from May, they can't make you pay even part of the water bill.

Call the RTA. They are really helpful.

[forshelby]

My agent is looking at our full lease and will get back to me. We've never paid for water usage in the entire 8yrs I've been independant. That's why this bill was such a shock.

I'm willing to come to a new agreement for any future usage, but since we were given no notice, I won't be paying this one. If they wish to draw up an agreement, I will sign. But until I have this in writing, they haven't got a hope in hell.

I'm just really annoyed they would spring this on us. Why they didn't tell me in NOV last year (start of billing period) is beyond me. Unless they got a shock when they opened their bill, and just decided to have us pay it. All the same, they can't just change the rules without letting me know.

Annoying!

[Just Me]

I think there are some Real Estate Agents who play on the ignorance of tenants who don't understand the law. They are not all like this, but there are some. I find that telling them that I will contact the RTA and get back to them has usually worked well in the past. I have had a couple back right off and tell me not to get my knickers in a knot (I wasn't upset at all, simply stating what I was going to do but I suspect they had a reason to be defensive).

I don't see how they can make you pay it. Also, it is worth finding out if your house is fitted with water saving devices because if it isn't, they can't make you sign a new contract making you responsible for your water usage either. If the water saving devices are fitted, it should greatly reduce the cost of the water bill meaning there is less to pay. It is not your fault if the people that own the house haven't put water saving devices in and the legislation is designed to encourage them to do it.

[forshelby]

No water saving devices are fitted. Our insulation was removed in January, causing our electricity to double in cost, so I really don't want to take on another utility. I might actually request insulation be redone.

I'm yet to hear back from the agent,so I hope it means she's made a mistake.

[Janie71]

I know here is VIC that if the property is separately metred then the landlord pays the sewerage etc and the tenant pays the usage. But in saying that the tenant receives a bill from the Water Company. We are about to get tenants into our apartment and we have been told by the water company that they will bill us for our part and the tenant for their part.

Seems very unfair to have a bill sprung on you out of the blue.

Janie xxx

[Jaycee]

Why did they take your insulation out? If your bill has doubled I'd definitely request it be redone!

[forshelby]

It was apparently poorly installed, so the landlord decided it should come out. We agreed, not realising the massive effect it'd have. I hope he's kind enough to have it put back in.

[~ Zarava Flutterby ~]

Hopefully they put it back In for you. Some landlords however won't do it for someone who is 'out of contract' though IYKWIM, hopefully they don't use that against you.


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- Sent from my iPhone, more than likely while I should be doing something else!

[misty]

Landlords in ACT, NSW and (now) QLD are all entitled to pass on the cost of the water usage to the tenant. (These changes to the tenancy legislation is pretty recent in QLD I believe).

I know that we get the water and sewage rates (with the water usage on it as well) for our investment property and we pay it in full and then are entitled to collect from the tenant reimbursement for the water usage portion of it.


If you are unsure of your rights as a tenant, get in touch with your local tenants advocacy service (it is free) and ask them - they will be able to tell you specifics in relation to where you live exactly what the landlord must do in order to claim back water usage.

[YoYo]

As a WA landlord, over the last 2 and a bit years we've rented out our house, we have paid rates, and water usage was the responsibility of the tenants. We have a bore so our gardens don't increase the water usage, but if it did, we would offer to pay a portion of usage, but I don't think a landlord should be responsible for you having a shower or washing your dishes iykwim.

Also, because the landlord has to pay water rates, there isn't a separate water bill for usage in another name, it's just not possible.

I think they should have definitely let you know in writing, or brought it up somewhere. Put as much of what you talk about with agents etc in writing too... We rent out our place out privately, so everything is between me and the tenant.... Once an agent comes in, things can get a bit twisted, so put things in an email or letter when you can.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - I wonder what the kids are up to....Better go!

[MantaRay]

That must have been a shock for you Unfortunately I think you will find that in Qld tenants are required to pay water usage, but owners may choose to just pay it (and I think many do), or in the case of shared meters then the tenants don't have to pay. If you have a look in the RTA booklet, or on the RTA website, or ring the RTA, they can confirm whether that is correct. So probably you have been lucky so far not to have to pay and I think you will have to start paying now, unless the owner tells the agent not to worry. Do you think the owner has asked for the payment, or is this new agent just being really over-efficient and has assumed that she should ask you to pay because that's what was done where she used to work? I wonder if the owner wants you to pay now that you are not on a fixed-term lease?

[Heaven]

Yep, everyone pays for water now. I would check your lease, they probably slipped it in there last time. Actually I would sign a lease!!

[Floweryfields]

In my region of council, they have recently changed how they charge for water rates - much, much more expensive than previously. Most people who own rentals started charging their tenants for any excess use as it is now so costly. Perhaps that's what's happened in your area too.
However, they surely wouldn't be allowed to start charging without first advising/changing the lease I would've thought.

[forshelby]

There was nothing new on the last lease we were sent. No changes.

I'm not asking whether or not I should be responsible for our water usage. I get that we are. And that we've been lucky so far to not have to pay it. My issue is that they didn't give us any kind of warning, just sprung a bill on us. A bill which they've had since June.

I did hear the laws have changed in QLD and that the landlords can pass on usage costs to the tenant, but they don't have the right to do this without informing me first. As per our original agreement, I am not expected to pay this utility. Even though I'm not on a fixed lease, I still have a periodic agreement which operates under the same rules as our original lease. It's like they heard they can do this, and just decided to slog us with the bill out of the blue. I think that's really rude. If they expect us to pay for water usage, I will as of today. Not from November last year!

They can give me the adequate notice, and I'll comply. What I won't do, however.... is pay it just because they sent it to me, without some kind of explanation.

I still haven't heard anything back from the agent so she's either a) really busy b) not interested c) crap at her job.

[BeautifulMadness]

im not sure abt QLD, but they would have to give you the proper notice of any intent of change to you're lease, if its not already stated.

if you're water meter is only to you're property you as the tenant have to pay the water usage/ landlord pays the sewage costs. thats just the law, it doesnt have to be in you're lease. so you would have to pay for the useage you have used, even past.

maybe give you're water supplier a call aswell.

if you're property manager is anything like mine, lazy lol

[Marley&Me]

I would assume ANY changes have to be WRITTEN and sent to the tenants for them to sign. My friend is a property manager and everything has to be written and signed before any changes to anything are made. But I am in Melbourne.....